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(Inactive) Web Best Practices: Teleconference Details

Teleconference details

Agenda

Navigation Bar Rules
  • Nested list rules for headings
  • Use of ARIA role=navigation and other landmark roles
  • Proposed rule:
    • Warning: Include ROLE=navigation and aria-labelledby on the container
    • Warning: No region with ROLE=main
  • Is there something that could be used to encourage people to use ROLE=navigation on things other than ordered and unordered lists, is there a carrot?

Table Rule Issues

Unique form control labeling rules
  • Need to update rules to be more explicit about calculation of efective labels
  • Will try to have example rules be telecon today

New Best Practices Website

Minutes

Navigation Bar Rules
  • Proposed rule:
    • Warning: Include ROLE=navigation and aria-labelledby on the container
    • Warning: No region with ROLE=main
  • TO: Are there examples
  • NH: Implementation issues, could be before last H1
  • NH: What happens when role main is not on last H1
  • JG: There issues of mashup
  • JG: We would need to use HTML 5 validator
  • TO: Are there validation issues?
  • TO: Seems like we are jumping the gun, especially without validation
  • RS: We did make an exception for lang with XHTML 1.1, since xml:lang is not supported by assistive technology
  • RS: I think we need to help promote the new technologies
  • RS: I would encourage people to do it, but explain the validation problems
  • HR: As long as it is a warning, I think we are safe
  • HR: I would be more concerned about failures
  • HR: We are a group that is leading best practices
  • NH: I ran into a validation problem, with XHTML 1.1 Basic, my lang attribute caused it not to validate
  • NH: Couldn’t it be the case that when things are ignored
  • NH: If you understand why you don’t validate
  • JG: Use scripting techniques to ad the information onload
  • TO: That makes sense
  • NH: In the last item is there extra rules, to give people extra credit
  • NH: Suggest “Extra Credit” instead of a warning
  • RS: I like that
  • TO: A good idea, we have web develpers to do the right thing
  • JG: What would it take to add an extra credit type rule?
  • NH: I will need to look at it more closely
  • NH: Earlier we had 4 rule results, and I had to add a “fail” for absence of things, we know have 6 options
  • NH: I need them for the type of message
  • NH: It should not be too much work
  • JG: I think it is a good idea too, until we get more implementation experience
  • NH: There are issues of coding patterns
  • JG: Are people for both rules?
  • HR: I am in favor of main and navigation rules
  • TO: Is there a way to show people in a browser? For teaching.
  • JG: It is a part of the current Fireox extension and it is also in the firebug extension
  • TO: This is something a screen reader user can use
  • HR: Jaws has pretty good support, other vendors are in the process of implementation

Table Rule Issues
  • http://falling-leaf-productions.com/tableAccess/index.htm
  • RS: We felt it was not really table markup, they were really lists
  • RS: All but one of the examples was a heading followed by a list
  • TO: I have been in conversation with this web developer, it boils down to educating people, where there is viable way, to train developers
  • TO: They examples went out of their way to use CSS, but the information really doesn’t belong in tables
  • TO: These people are really trying to do the right thing, so we must be sensitive to that
  • JG: basicaly agree
  • RS: Yes, it sounds harsh to new web developers
  • MM: It is hard for developers who are use to using tables to move away from their use
  • TO: It is important features for the iCITA pages to show examples
  • TO: Any time we can lower the learning curve it is well worth the effort
  • HR: TO and RS you have good ways of explaining stuff, maybe you could write a draft of how to explain
  • RS: I end up doing the coding for new developers or content contributors
  • RS: I have not come up with a good way to explain the caveats of moving from tables to a CSS design
  • RS: CSS3 has some hope I hope it is implemented
  • HR: TO you sent some best practices
  • TO: I could start working on it, I would like to work with you’
  • TO: Web masters water cooler group has a blog
  • NH: The question seems to be more when you should use tables
  • TO: That really is the question
  • NH: Is the data two dimensional
  • MR: We have some floating DIV code examples
  • HR: Doug Burgett also has some examples

Unique form control labeling rules
  • wait until next

New Best Practices Website
  • http://webacc-dev.cita.illinois.edu
  • RS: I see some problems in the best practices
  • NH: I find the navigation hard to get back to where I was
  • NH: I was not seeing a relationship between a rule and examples
  • RS: I think it would be good to have links from the rules page to examples
  • TO: Under guidelines and standard the rules are not FAE compliant
  • TO: Some of the links are not underlined, some text styld that is not a link, people will miss information if they think something is a link.

Participants